Banking on Digital Growth
Banking on Digital Growth

Episode · 1 year ago

32) #DigitalGrowthJourney: When It Comes to Digital Growth, There’s No More Next Time w/ John Oxford

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

You may have heard of the 4 P’s of marketing.

Person, place, price, and promotion.

Well, in today’s marketing world, these are meaningless.

It’s time we start focusing on the 4 C’s of marketing.

In today’s Digital Growth Journey Series episode, I speak with John Oxford, Director of Marketing at Renasant Bank and author of No More Next Time, about how financial brand marketing needs to adapt to the modern — and post-COVID — era.

We discuss:

  • Why the 4 C’s are replacing the 4 P’s in modern marketing
  • Why now is the best time for digital growth
  • Why today’s marketing requires risk and aggressiveness

You can find this interview, and many more, by subscribing to Banking on Digital Growth on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or here.

Bankers mostly think about how can Ieliminate risk and how can I eliminate expenses, and so marketing is complete completely different. It's always a risk to put a message out there, whether itbe compliance risk, reputational risk, expense risk, there's always a risk.So you're doing something that makes you vulnerable out the gate. You're listening tobanking on digital growth with James Robert Leigh, a podcast that empowers financial brand marketing, sales and leadership teams to maximize their digital growth potential by generating tentimes more loans and deposits. Today's episode is part of the digital growth journeysseries, where James Robert Uncovers and explores some of the industry's biggest digital marketingand sales stories of success. Let's get into the show. Greetings and hello. I am James Robert Lagh and welcome to another episode of the banking ondigital growth podcast. Today's episode is part of the Digital Growth Journey series andI'm excited to welcome John Oxford to the show because John has a new book. No more next time. Marketing in the age of distraction. I havethis here in my hand. Highly recommend you go and pick up a copytoday. In addition to launching his new book, John is also the directorof marketing and public relations at Nizent Bank, as well as the cohost of themarketing money podcast. Welcome to the show, John, Hey James,thanks for having me, especially with a all this going on, and Iwish we could be in the same studio or same conference and but it's itdoes zoom, thinks cool. So it's the kind of the new world we'rein right now. It really is. And you know, let's talk aboutthat, because this, this post covid nineteen world that I'm calling it,really requires all of us to rethink about how we're positioning, about how we'remarketing, about how we're communicating about our financial brands in the communities that weserve. You're on the front lines doing this and I understand that for manyfinancial brand marketing team sells teams, leadership teams, it's so easy to feelfrustrated, so easier to fill overwhelmed with everything going on. But what isone thing right now that you're excited about, based upon the work that you're doingat Your Bank? Well, one thing that's that's excited and it's inthe name of of Your Company and podcast is the digital aspect of it.I'man we've had a chance to relook at how we approach banking with traditional retailcustomers. You know, most banks now I've moved to a teller, excuseme, a drive through on a platform with if you want to see ateller you have to make an appointment. Go inside if you need your safedeposit box or something like that. So what an opportunity to look at youre look at your website, re look at your APP re look at theinteractions you have over digital and it. I think it's kind of fast forwardedbanks. There's always an event about every end years or so that fast forwardsbanking. Remember, not eleven, we got check, twenty one. Yep, and so you could didn't go.

You didn't have to have all thepaperwork before, because it's kind of moved. I think this is going to moveus to a lot of customers and class realizing hey, I can dothat mobile deposit. I was just slow to adopted. I can do aZel payment, I was slow to adopted. Oh, I can do more aloan APP over the Internet. I can use Docu sign, I cando all these things. That maybe I wasn't doing before and be healthy anddoing it. So it took a weird route to get there, but Ithink covid night teen's going to be one of those kind of bell cows forfor a point when digital really became more of a priority than even it wasbefore. It really is it's that. It's that crisis, but it's fromcrisis we get reinvention and we get transformation and we're going to come out onthe other side to be that much better, something Jim Rouse and I have talkedabout on a previous podcast, and let's talk about that, that ideaof reinvention, that idea of transformation. I've mentioned your book no more nexttime, marketing in the age of distraction. I get it. We're living inthe age of distraction. We're living in the age of AI. It'sexponential change happening. is but what do you mean specifically by no more nexttime? So in today's consumer centric market, you can start with the big ones, that Amazon's, the online ecommerce distributors. That's now expected in banking. It's just everything. You know. Can I sign up online? CanI fund my Count Online? Can I transfer? Can I pay online?Can I do a loan online and to run my Treasury Services Online? Andif you have to send friction to your customers, there's friction in the experience. There will not be a next time anymore. If you can't get whatyou want right now. It's a it's a MIMIMI society, from memes toselfies to all the vernacular this out there. If you can't get it right now, there is no more next time. If I can't get it at thisplace, I'm just going to click and get it somewhere else. Soyou have to have your commerce, your transfer, your whatever it is thatyou want to call it for your bank ready for for now, because ifyou miss it, there's not going to be a next time. If Ican't get my loan here today, I'm just clicking to the next bank.I'm not driving down the street, I'm doing it from my kitchen table withmy phone in my hand at midnight if I want to. So there's nomore next time if you miss your opportunity in today's marketplace, and that ideaof no more next time, meeting people where they are, I think ismore relevant now in this post covid nineteen world. You mentioned it you drivethroughs or shut down. This is going to just like it's forcing financial brandsto change our behaviors, our way of thinking. It's also forcing consumers totransform their behavior and their ways of thinking that they might not go back,and they probably won't go back because those new behaviors will be new habits,particularly when it comes to activities like banking. So the the experiences that people expectfrom a financial brand are being set by gaff of the Google's, theAmazon, to the facebook, the the the apples of the world. Inthe opening pages of your book you write you might look at this book andthink, I've already seen a thousand marketing...

...books. Why does there need tobe one more? It's a great question. And look, it's in the ouity, but the reader, you know, out of the beholder. But Ifeel like there's so much traditional person place, price promotion, the oldpeas I said, let's place doesn't matter anymore. Price almost doesn't matter becauseyou can find discount you can find wholesales, you can find ways around things withbanks, you can look at different pricing. So it almost doesn't matterbecause the value may be more important than the fee. And then people,if you talk about digital the person is important as a programmer or a datascientist or whatever you have, but it's not important as it used to be, where you would traditionally go down meet with someone and get your load andgo to a credit process which credits to important. But my point of thatis that I think we've moved to a foresee versus a four P and mineis is content, connection, conversion and all that's wrapped in campaigns, thedelivery mechanism, and so I think it starts with content. How are yougetting the customer to pay attention because they're distracted and there's no more next time. If they miss it, then how do you connect with them? Movethem to a conversion and you wrap those in a campaign of delivery. Sothat's where what the book really goes through is the Fur seas of modern marketing. Yeah, you know, I love that, because that idea, theold world of price placement, product promotion, transforming that thinking through your forces model. But it comes back to the idea of meeting people where they are, creating value, promoting transformations of people versus the promotion of a commoditized product. Let's actually break into one of those, those specific sees the idea of connection, because this is a repeated pattern that I'm hearing from those that I'vebeen interviewing for the podcast, along with the primary research that we've been doinghere at the Digital Growth Institute. Connection, and really human connection in this digitalworld is going to be more important than ever before because we're in thebanking of of people. Were in the business of people. It's a humaninteraction. Let's talk about what you call the great eight of connection. Yes, so the great eight connection are just the steps to connect with and Iguess I could open up and read it to you, but but I reallywant to go down the point of its. It's mass intimacy and it's it's amass communication, this intimate because of this little tool right here, thislittle thing that every person probably has. An I say in my book don'twrite to absolute so we can speak to them and it. Most people haveone or two phones in fact, and their family plan with four people havingthem, and IPADS and iphones and androids and so is created a mass intimacymarket. I think you see that with a product that just rolled out lastweek in Quibby, a short form content delivery that connects because you're going tobed. I can't watch it to our movie, but I can watch aseven minute show and absorbed that before I fall asleep and I think that fitsto connectivity and that speak to your audience.

Don't bring negative stereotypes into it.Be Quick, be accurate and, you know, use good production valueto show that you're a professional entity. But and we can talk more aboutquick, because I think that is a bell cow for where maybe content isgoing and banks should pay attention to that. I'm going to talk about it asI make rounds. But to your point of this whole thing in theconnectivity. It has to connect. It can't just be the same old handshake. I used to laugh and make fun of banks in their advertising and sayto the CFPB say you had to have a handshake in your advertising because everybank would show a friendly person handshaking in the AD. Well, now peopledon't hind shake anymore because of covid nineteen. So do adds. Do Banks evenhave any advertising they can put in the market place right now, becauseit was all handshakes? I used to laugh at that and now handshakes arepass they're done with for the time being. So that would that would be apoint of connectivity. Are you connecting with where your audiences your point rightnow? They're not handshaking, so how are you meeting them with the narrativeof where they're living their life? No handshakes, the probably not going inthe bank. They're not seeing the pretty tailer line with it all cleaned up. Their banking is at their kitchen table, on their laptop, it's on theirphone or it might be a phone call if they're walking through the thePPP lung process with Uba. But other than that, stuff of your deadown. It is right now, right where the consumer is, and theconsumers at home. The consumer is at home and that present some challenges anda few different aspects. Let's get into the hearts and minds of people,because that isolation number one. We're communal creatures. Were meant to be togetherand share a sense of purpose. But if I'm at home alone, I'misolated, and I'm a home alone, isolated, I'm worrying about my financialsituation. What are the opportunities for a financial brand to provide a little bitof help, to provide even, probably more so, not just help buteven hope to that person sitting at home alone, worried, stressed, frustrated. So I think there's three or four things you can do. One iswe, we are in as not produce some content where we did at somethat we caught there, like skits, but they're just short form content pieces. And I joke we were doing quibby before quimby was the quibby. Butwe did one where it was staying at home and the dog always wanted towalk, can pay attention and was bugging the person. We've done one whereit was about homeschooling and it joked about how tough homeschooling is on a parentwho's not used to being a teacher. And so we've done some stuff tomake you feel like, yeah, I'm part of this community and that relatesto me. So one is the content, the connectivity, and at the endit's not a hard brand cell. It's just, Hey, we're InzaBank. Our tagline is understanding you. We understand our consumer. We showthat in our content. Then the next part is, okay, they've kindof hung on to you and your content. How do you connect what? Wehave products, mobile, checking, transfer Zel, all these other productswhich we don't need to go those your audience. One know them, buthow do you then deliver that so the customers aware? Again, we sawa big uptick in seniors, the senior demographic, calling our cost center sayinghey, how do I get on online...

...banking? MMM, they've been online, they have a computer. JUST STU to not. They probably had,you know, their grandson come over and hate set up my APP and I'llget to it when I can. Or our son can you, you know, the old help me fix the VC? Our story. We've seen that alot in some of our banking and that a newer demographic, sixty fiveplus, have really turned onto digital banking now and we have numbers to backthat up at but it's just interesting because they could always do it. It'sjust like why take the time? I can get out and drive. Idon't, you know, I'm retired, I have the time to just doold school banking. And now it's like, Oh, I can do this andthere find out how efficient it is and how healthy it is at thesame time. Yeah, and that's the idea that you know, now thatwe're seeing that behavior change, new habits are being formed. Odds are it'sprobably not going to go back to the way that it was in the precovid nineteen world. You're talking a little bit about these go to market strategies, these these these content, pieces of short form content. One of thechallenges, and you write about this in the book, that that I seewith financial brand marketing teams is for far too long they've been viewed as acost center. Some feel like they're nothing more than a glorified inhouse kin goes. Or worse, and I quote, and I've heard this a few timesnow, is that people think that we're just kids that play with Peyton crayons. Like, I get it. I get I get why marketing has beenviewed that way historically. However, the good news for for for all ofus, is that the world has changed. Marketing can prove its value and that'swhy you one of the the forceas you write about, is conversion.Can you provide some perspective for a financial brand marketing team, of cells,team, of leadership team, about what are the types of conversions that wecan track beyond just the the affinity of brand recognition? Yeah, so,so I always say you got to start with brand, though, and thereason and then I'm going to get to your question. But I want toset it up. Sure, there's five six thousand banks right now. Ifyou want the credit uns and there there's probably thirteen thousand of us. Let'sjust it could be twelve, it could be fourteen, but let's just saythirteen for a number of thousand. I believe in banking there's some some research. Seventy percent share a common word in their name. We all first national, state, trust, merchant, farmer, something like, you know in adirection north sounds like there's we share a name. So you've automatically debrandedyourself with a name. Then throw in the ultimate commodity of banking, ischecking, it's lending, and then, as in, a treasury and afew other products. But and then this overly regulated by a government. Soyou can't go out and do some of the things that fintach may try todo in some other stuff. So you're that in this box, Yep,and so you're really only way out. You can't really introduce any o thebox prod products because you got a core that limits you. You've got regulations. So it's got to be brand, it's got to be what's your canyou do a name? Can you do a logo? That stands out witha story, in a narrative that sets you apart. So okay, sostarts to band. Let's take brand out of the way. Move to conversionbecause, like you said, it's just...

...a bunch of people with crayons tryingto draw pretty pictures and say, Oh, look at that pretty add but it'smore than that. Now it's using an mcif orcrm to track data.And then how do you put your data into play? One way we sawis, and this is a simple one, look at the bounce rate and thehit on your home page. Eighty nine to eighty five to nine percentof your of your hits, are just going their log in. They're notlooking in anything on your site. Your spend all this time doing content andbuilding all this robust you know how to video whatever. All they're doing isclicking the log in, going straight to the core and do the transaction gettingout. That's why we started a content site. But that's how you canuse data to look at conversions, because you're not converting anyone directly on yourwebsite. You need to go through. Is it's Youo fencing? Is itweb? Is it native advertising? Is it brand and click helps on thatwith a lot account opening processes, but you can go through. You know, a couple of years ago we met with a major brand and big Amazontype atbs type serves and they were saying social media won't convert anybody to abank client and I said I think it will, and I've seen a lotof proof of that. Is If you have a tracking system like social studioor the grimlins and social assurance and all these other vendors that are out there, partners that are out there to banks, and you probably do it too,you can go through and track complaints and say a bank has a complaint, will hop in right behind there and say hey, we may be ableto help you, and then they click to it. If you bring theaccount over, you've literally formed a conversion off of social media post and that'syou have to be kind of hyper active on social monitoring to do that,but that's the way you can do it. Another good conversion metric right now islook at your drive through tellers, because it covid people are just drivingthrough for going in, and see how many of those transactions could be movedto a digital transaction. So if you see that twenty or thirty percent ofyour class are just cashing a check in the drift through and it's under youryour maximum ceiling of a check to deposit. Pass them a note and found whodoes? Send them an email, since something that says hey, doyou know you could be doing this, and walk them through the step todo it and you'll move them to be an a digital consumer. And it's, like you mentioned earlier. Once they do it once or twice, usuallythey have now adopted that pattern in their banking. Yeah, you know,what I'm hearing is two things. One, it's the art and science of marketingcolliding. It's not just the pretty pictures, but it's the data andthen being able to figure out what that means and applying that the context ofcontent and context. But I really liked your your perspective to about social listening, listening to those who might be in need and in coming to them witha solution, saying hey, we're here to help. Yeah, I meanthat's that's that's almost not only marketing art and science cliding, but it's likemarketing and cells colliding now, and so we got all of this overlap andwe're all working towards a bigger purpose which comes back to your point. Itstarts with brand, the idea of purpose and why do we do what wedo? How can a financial brand position...

...around brand digitally if we might nothave the face to face interactions that we once were used to having? Precovid nineteen so so a lot of those content and building really good, attractivecontent and and you've got to get away from, and I joke about it, but the handshake and kind of the traditional, wholesome, whole spun.It's got to be more. What are you doing for the client? Whatvalue are you bringing? And in some of it can be entertainment or Infotametor even comedy. Because, to your point on the social if I seeanother bank of clients having problems with another bank and they post a complaint andyou come under it and you say we would love to help you. We'reNorth West, South Trust Bank of the first, we don't know who youare, but you come by and say we're renaissance. We're truest. I'mjust saying names that are kind of unique and they've heard of your brand andmaybe seen it. So if they're in the southeast, we hope they've heardof us. It's like, Oh, I've seen that bank stuff. Oh, you're got. You're the guys that do sec shorts. You're the guysthat do so, true are you're the guys that do dream together with theNashville Mla soccer team. Oh, I've heard of you. Yeah, gladyou reached out. So you've already built some brand awareness, or at leastsome brand empathy when you touch them digitally. All on their complaint. that youunderstand, and then you're trying to bring them and so I think itdoes start with brand, but then you have to back it up with theproduct. Yeah, that's you know, that's the digital aspect is. Wecould tell them where the greatest bank in the world and then if they geta not good experience, well then you've lost your brand promise. So ithas to be again, art and sciences, art and science, like you said. So you said it better than I can right there. Technology hastransformed our world and digital has changed the way consumer shop for and buy financialservices forever now. Consumers make purchase decisions long before they walk into a branch, if they walk into a branch at all. But your financial brand stillwants to grow loans and deposits. We get it. Digital growth can feelconfusing, frustrating and overwhelming for any financial brand marketing and sales leader. Butit doesn't have to, because James Robert wrote the book that guides you everystep of the way along your digital growth journey. Visit www dot digital growthcomto get a preview of his best selling book banking on digital growth, ororder a copy right now for you and your team from Amazon. Inside you'llfind a strategic marketing manifesto that was written to transform financial brands and it ispacked full of practical and proven insights you can start using today to confidently generateten times more loans and deposits. Now back to the show. Using digitalto take that a little bit further, using content to really make deposits ina consumers mental trust fund, because it's they might not take action at thatmoment in time, because we know that...

...buying a financial product is a verycomplex journey. It's not point a to point B, it's Aida Zed andthere's all of these little nuances that happen in between. But content, asas we talk about here at the digital inst content is the fuel of thedigital growth engine. It's what makes all the gears turn, whether it's insocial whether it's in marketing automation, whether it's in a crm, content isreally central to everything and I think that's that's that's why I was fascinated inthe book you wrote marketing is ultimately vulnerability because you're putting your message, yourcontent, out there, and when you put anything out there's feedback. Alot of folks, you write, are scared about marketing, of the vulnerabilityof putting themselves out there. So not everyone is a great marketer. Whatdo you mean by that? Well, let's think about this. You workin the financial service industry. I do as well. There's two things thingsbankers hate, risk and expense. They like to save money, better marginit. It's all about saving, not spending on the bank side. Andthen risk. They don't like risk. We like to know what's going on, we know our clients. There's the credit piece of it, and sowhen you got bankers mostly think about how can I eliminate risk and how canI eliminate it expenses, and so marketing is complete, completely different. It'salways a risk to put a message out there, whether it be compliance risk, reputational risk, expense risk. There's always a risk. So you're doingsomething that makes you vulnerable out the gate. I've had plenty of campaigns that werecompletely rejected by executive management when we when I pitched them, and I'vehad plenty that it that have been like this is going to be the coolestthing you've ever done. And so it's almost like when your actors talking aboutwhen they go pitch to be in a movie or something, how many timesthey get turned down, even the best ones, before they get on.Like you're rejected for four hundred before you land one. It's kind of amarketing is a lot of your ideas and a lot of your creative is goingto be rejected because of risk and expense. You know you want to make thishuge ad, will they won't pay for it, or you want todo something that's really cool, but does it? Is it too funny?And so your bank is more of a stage column marble looking bank, andso trying to be humorous isn't really in your brand narrative. So then thatgets pushed aside because of a risk that maybe, as a Steo, thinksthey don't want to do. And so it is vulnerable because you're putting yourselfout there. You're taking a risk on reputation, you're taking a risk ona building, an audience, and so so look, and you're doing everythinggets what banks to risk and expense, because you're spending money without a sureRoi. On the front end with content. Now, look, you can buildit, you can build in our model, but on the front endwhen you're pitching it, it's really hard to unless you just kind of makingit up a true rol, especially in just brand and so look, I'mtelling you, it's vultable and and markers have to be brave. I knowit sounds funny, but it's like, I don't want to be demeaning towardsmilitary baskin. Being a soldier, you...

...got to go out there and putyour guns out and take your shot and a lot of times you're going tomiss and a lot of times you're going to hit, but you got tobe brave and I you got to be willing to take some risk and Idon't think banks do that enough. And I don't mean like crazy risks,like don't get into like compliance issues and trying to mislead or anything, butyou've got to get out there. I'm just banks, we're real hesitant toget out there and try to be as good at marketing it is. Ithink we can be. So I've been advocating for years for financial brand marketingteams to transform beyond just like the commoditized promotion of the commoditized campaign, makeinvestments and content even to the point to where marketing looks and acts more likea media team. There you go, and I get the idea of risk. But here's the thing. If, and this is this is like justthinking out loud, how much will it cost a financial brand if they don'tfind the courage to commit and take action in this post covid nineteen world?What's the risk in that? Well, I think we have to look atyour exact words. I don't think you'll be a brand. I think you'lljust be a random money transfer building on the corner. I think he you'll, you'll, you'll be a location that people won't even think about because youwon't be where they are. You won't computer, you'll be a static thing. You won't be a brand. Yeah, so, so I think postcovid it'sgoing to be customer service is going to be an all time high thatit's a different type of customer service. The ability to meet the customer fromtracking Crm mcif systems, automated campaigns ai is still it depends on your audience. There's certain audience that, like frinds with the PPP loan program there werecertain people that wanted a banker to talk to them every day and tell themwhere they are in the process that they're APP with the SBA. There areothers that want to just log on, pipe in their their tax records andtheir payroll forms, hits in and then just wait on an email. Soyou really have to know which ones. But I think that's meeting the clientwhere they want to be. I think that's where comedie banks can do reallywell because they still have relationship model, but if they'll invest in digital andinvest in that, in technologies in that area, I believe that's where meBates can win moving forward, is is they stay with that customer that stillneeds that handhold, but they can move digital. Now your major money centers, they've gone almost all digital. We've seen it play out with SBA.We've seen it play out what's going on right now. I think it's goodfor them because they have such a mass amount of customers it's almost hard forthem to touch that small customer in a rural area. So I'm not pickingon big banks all they're doing it correctly with their digital aspects, but Ithink community makes need to adopt more that digital aggressiveness post covid because it's goingto be the way they can deliver, because now they can deliver content andthey can see who's reading it, they...

...can see WHO's opening it, theycan tailor it towards the customer based on certain criteria. And so I'm tellingyou, post COVID, if you're not into content connection and conversion, andI wrote this before I even knew what corona was going to be, itjust so falls into what I think the next play is going to be.Throw the four peas out and use the three C's delivered through campaigns needed forto match the for but it's really three CS that you need to pay attentionto. Yeah, you know, it's really and to come back. It'sabout gaining clarity into what the opportunities are. It's about building courage and commitment tomove forward with the solidified strategy and then it's about having the confidence justto take the next step and apply some of this thinking, but also transformingthe conversation from a conversation and moving beyond the conversation. We felt we didn'tget what we needed. No, it's we didn't fail. This is whatwe learn and that's what we can do even better next time. So thinkingabout being even better next time. Let's take a moment as we wrap upand really such a great conversation with you today. John. Appreciate all theprop shit practical knowledge in the insights. I'm a financial brand marketing team leader. I'm in cells, I'm on the leadership team of a financial brand.What is one thing that you could recommend for me to not only think aboutbut to find that courage to commit to do over the next twelve months inmy own journey of growth? So, if you mentioned those are different positions, but let's hit on all of them. Sure, I think adopting digital asa platform to deliver your brand and your message. And so it's ifyou're not good on camera, start blogging. If you're not good on at bloggingand writing, find a staff member to do it for you, ghostright for you, get out there on social media, twitter, linked inand start engaging with these audiences, engaging for your bank, and then seeif you're marketing team can help you amplify that message. And you know,I've heard it said that branding is basically a promise backed up by an experience. It's a promise, so we're promising something and then when the consumer takesyour promise it has to be backed about the experience. So bankers need torealize we're going to start making promises on what we can do and deliver itthrough digital channels. I can't tell how many bankers I've got lined up thathave been at home now and have now gotten comfortable with zoom and gotten comfortableseeing themselves on camera talking and they're like, you know what, I want todo a little show, I want to do a little marketing minute everyweek. I want to do a little product update. So Product Update,so you're getting our service update and and testimonial stories. I know that's asold as anything, a cont testimony story, but what did you do as abank to help your customers during covid and then how can you share thosestories now that you've built that trust? That then becomes the promise built bythat experience. So again it all come back to that. But if Iwas going to do one thing coming out of this, I would get onprobably Linkedin, if not facebook's a little bitit more like family personal but Iwould adopt linked in, maybe post it...

...all on twitter. Two, butreally attack a lot of content on what I did, my expertise and shareit with the world and engage with my marketing team to help me Polish itup. You know, quick cuts, logo, maybe some some you know, music that's right, copyright free or whatever, trademark free music, CopyrightFree Music, and I go out there and I would really hit my contentdelivery as quickly as I could afterwards. Yeah, what you're salty? FreeMusic. I was I was miss misquoting myself. The Reality Free Music andknow what you're speaking on is such a solid path forward because really we've movedfrom traditionally what in financial services would have been a service economy. That becamethe experience economy. But my prediction is that covid nineteen is forcing us toreally level up and elevate ourselves into what I'm going to call the knowledge orthe expertise economy, because financial services is a very complex subject matter and youknow, people oftentimes have a false sense of confidence that they know what theyneed to do with their money. But just like any of us, likeif you have a health problem, you're going to call a doctor, ifyou have a car problem, you're going to go see an auto mechanic,just like if I have a money problem, I want to position my financial brandas the expert in the local market place. And I like what yousaid. You've got a lot of bankers who are sitting at home. They'regetting comfortable using this video communication, like we are right now on zoom,but we're also getting the audio for the podcast. And recalls a conversation Ihad like last week with a group of thirty financial brand leaders in around table. They're like, well, what if it's not good enough? Don't letfear hold you back. That's the whole thing right there, when we talkedabout fear and and and risk, and then you talk about, you know, that whole thing, you know, just being vulnerable. That's what itis. And if you're in, if you're not, you're going to lose. I hate to say it that way, but you might have an old portfoliothat you can manage into you retired, that you've kind of, you know, inherited in the bank. But if you're A, I would sayif you're a forty is shit, younger banker, and this is not today, but, like you know, an experience banker, they're going to beable to navigate this with probably their pass portfolio, in their experience, whichagain to your point that they're now trusted advisor and they're vising those class whatthey can do. But they've already got the experience dance because they're known inthe market place, they have a legacy portfolio, that know what they're doing. But if you're kind of in that middle to younger demographic digital is yourplatform. Look, it can be instagram pictures of your customers holding the checkthey got here, standing outside reopening their business. I mean there's so manystories to be told Post covid but's your point. You got to have thatvulnerable building and look, just take it on the chin. When I whenwe did started marketing money podcast, tons of friends, we all rib eachother and I was like, my friends are going to kill me, they'regoing to haze me so bad. Did I found out all my friends werelistening to it and they would like jokingly send me text of quotes and justsilly stuff. We say on the show that this is hilarious or this Ilearned something today and some of them are just got to learn anything. ButI'm listening to you because I'm your buddy.

But, like, you've got toget through. I think a lot of the vulnerabilities of well, somebodyelse is do it, someone else is smarter than me, someone else knowsthis better. Dude, like that's done with like to build your audience.Go out there. Maybe you're better at delivering the message and that if you'renot as smart, maybe they're, maybe they're better delivering, but you're smarter, like there's always a niche you can find in your personality to deliver thisstuff. It's so it's got to be content delivery on your expertise as abanker. So I'm hearing really kind of two things as we wrap up.Number One, you talked about the under forty leader, but I'm I'm gonnagive a different perspective. I had a my wife and I had a personalconversation recently with her asthtician here in Houston, and and this woman, her nameis Linda and she has an El Skin Boutique and she's been shut downfrom now for like four to six weeks. Is like, I don't know howmuch longer I can handle this. And I said, Linda, she'ssixty eight. I said, Linda, this is your opportunity to reinvent yourself. I said you have all this time on your hands, get a phoneand start giving product reviews about the products that you're using with clients. Tellthem, like what problem this product solved, tell them why it's important to solvethat problem and show them how to use it and then you post thaton Youtube and then you share that with just your clients and ask them toshare that with a friend. And I said You'd do this time and timeagain. It's going to get easier and easier and easier. So here's thething. You've been doing this yourself and, like you said, you know whenyou started the podcast you're afraid people are going to give you a hardtime, but no people were listening because you were creating value for them.I think we use that term earlier. It's about value creation. If someonewants to connect with you, John, to continue the dialog that we've startedtoday, continue the conversation. What's the best way for them to connect withyou? So the best way is easily just let me up on Linkedin oryou can you can email me. I do have a little like General CampCampaign Marketing help at GMAILCOM. Campaign Marketing help at GMAILCOM. And one lastthing. I'll say this because I put in my book I got one ofthose Google text deals and I don't have the number of memorize. It's sofresh. Six two two zero five, six two eight hundred and eighty.Six, six two two zero five, six to eight eight. You cantext me at our respond if you want to have a conversation, if youwant to talk about the book, If you want to make fun of meor have may make fun of you. Whatever it is, I'm game forany of that because I think we all have to help each other right nowand help each other through this, and then on the other side we canall be peers and celebrate our success together. That's right, John, Hey,get the book. No more next time. Marketing in the age ofdistraction. John, thanks again for joining me on another episode of banking ondigital growth. Thanks, James, for Shay you. Until next time.Be well, do good and wash your hands. Thank you for listening toanother episode of banking on Digital Growth with James Robert Laigh. Like what youhear, tell a friend about the podcast and leave us a review on applepodcast, Google podcasts or spotify, and...

...subscribe while you're there. To geteven more practical, improven insights, visit www dotal growthcom to grab a previewof James Roberts best selling book banking on digital growth, or order a copyright now for you and your team from Amazon. Inside you'll find a strategicmarketing and sales blueprint framed around twelve key areas of focus that empower you toconfidently generate ten times more loans and deposits. Until next time, be well anddo good.

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