Banking on Digital Growth
Banking on Digital Growth

Episode · 1 year ago

65) #ExponentialInsights: Bank of Tomorrow: Why We Should Look Outside the Industry w/ Bryan Clagett

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

It’s not hard to see the financial industry has become stifled.

It’s a victim of its own success and the commoditization of its products.

And to fix it, we need to look outside the industry.

In today’s episode, I’m joined by Bryan Clagett, Chief Revenue Officer (CRO) at Moven, to talk about why financial brands would do well to look for inspiration from outside the market.

We discuss:

  • Why innovation has slowed in the financial industry
  • How other industries may be the key to solving the problem
  • What the future of finance — and fintech, in particular — looks like

You can find this interview, and many more, by subscribing to Banking on Digital Growth on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or here.
 

...on your visibility out in the market and how Maney prospects you're actually visiting. That's really not a good metric. Necessarily. It's the quality of the engagement a council you're listening to. Banking on Digital Growth with James Robert Lay, a podcast that empowers financial brand marketing, sales and leadership teams to maximize their digital growth potential by generating 10 times more loans and deposits. Today's episode is part of the exponential insight Siri's, where James Robert interviews the industry's top marketing sales, and Fintech leaders sharing practical wisdom toe exponentially elevate you and your team. Let's get into the show. Greetings in Hello, I Am James Robert Ley and welcome to the 65th episode of the Banking on Digital Growth podcast. Today's episode is part of the exponential insight Siri's and I'm excited to welcome Brian. Clog it to the show. Brian is a strategic leader helping Fintech and Finn serv when market share, who most recently drove G Zeos marketing efforts as the CMO and investor helping to sell the company to Jack Henry and Associates in July of 2019. Since then, Brian has taken up advisory roles at Channel Net Blip Nimbus, in addition to running badass banking on a mission to help banks, credit unions and fintech create a better financial services experience for both consumers and business. Hello, Brian. And welcome to the show today. Good to see you, my man. I am I am is good to see you. I'm always thrilled to be on your show and just sometimes just catch up with you. Yeah, it is always good. You know, it's been over 10 years now since we first connected and have had a lot of good conversations, good experiences presenting together over the years and sharing knowledge and insight. And and that's really my hope today is just, uh, transfer knowledge...

Thio the dear listener from your lens of the world. And what, your dear listener, that sounds very North Korean. The D Oh, dear listener. Um, no, no, no, no North Korea happening over here. But when we look at and reflecting back on 2020 just for you personally, what would have been some of the biggest lessons that have come out of the what? I'm calling the 2020 experience? Well, I worked with a lot of brands in, uh, 2020 and I think when we started this experiment will call it or experience back in March. I think people are really panicked right on day. And I think there was a fear that it wasn't just a fear of the disease but a fear of the economic collapse. And obviously things have been tough for millions in America. And I think a lot of bankers, the credit union folks included in the Frontex were really worried that their physical presence was gonna cause a buzzer demise. And, you know, they're gonna They're gonna have a cultural fallout from a staffing point of view because we went from seeing people in offices to having these, you know, work from home experiences. What I've learned work from home has actually done great. Ah, lot of people are really benefiting from it. I think some organizations are stronger because of it. Even culturally, I think there's been a remarkable amount of productivity that's come out of some of these financial institutions. Certainly the thin texts and we adapted right, and another lesson learned was the fact that it's not just the younger folks out there, the millennials that are adopting technology, it's, you know, old sparks like me and and you know Gen y Gen x. You know, they're all out there and they're using technology, and they're finding that it's pretty darn easy. And the bankers were realizing they don't have to have the same...

...physical attributes they always had. They actually can survive in a digital world. You know, I think back in in hearing your reflection, this idea of the physical versus the digital world and some of the fear. I mean, I was launching a book in 2020 and had all of these big plans and book tours, and then all of that got shut down. But I gotta tell you, I was way more efficient, way more productive in this digital zoom conversation world. I don't No, if I want to go back to the way things were before because we've seen so much opportunity as it stands today, what I'd like to get back and meet people again in the world, you know, give him a hug and shake their hand? Absolutely. But I think there's gonna be a balance. It's like way gotta find this new. Thats new level of comfort. What do your thoughts on that? No, I think you're right. I think it's a balance. I mean, you know, when I was a strategy core and I spent a year with them, just about I love those guys, great product. But I was spending a lot of time in airports. Andi, that was There was a lot of downtime. Granted, I'm addicted to social, and I'm you know, I'm always firing out emails and messages, so maybe I'm a little more productive than theatrics. Person is in an airport, But that was time down. The time I'm spending now, and the time that I see a lot of the sales guys that I know they're no longer quote unquote on the road. You know, they're they're still productive, you know, they're meeting as many people, maybe even Mawr. I think the harder challenge is how to make those interactions quality oriented. It's not just a quantity issue, but if you're a sales guy, you know, sometimes your success is measured on on your visibility out in the market and how maney prospects you're actually visiting. That's really not a good metric. Necessarily. It's the quality of the engagement accounts, and ultimately you know, it's the impact you have meaning? Are you...

...driving sales? I think there's, you know, a lot of truth with that. Because personally speaking, you know, I've enjoyed being able to advise, you know, top 15 over in Europe. Uh, then hop over to the Caribbean and then go over tow California all in one day on go home and sleep in my bed at night so and and actually get quality sleep and see my wife see my kids. But then I also think, you know, from the lens I'm a c l o. You know, I'm a lending ml Oi! I have my own book of business commercial lending at a bank. What bu I can't go play golf anymore, But I can get on linked in and, you know, make all of these connections and have BJ. Paultre and I were talking about this on a previous episode and be a lot more efficient, but it takes a different mindset. It takes a different operational model, and and it really forces us to look for the opportunities that we might not have ever considered before. When we were on the golf course, spending four or five hours with, you know, three other people. When we look at those opportunities, particularly from the work that you're doing the collaboration between financial brand and fintech, what are those opportunities that you see in 2021 beyond? Well, I think that I think it goes back to theme that I've always believed in. And that's just this, uh, concept of engagement banking how Toe Bankers and credit. You know, I would say Bankers Right Credit union years bankers the same thing. How does financial the financial industry? The financial services industry is the whole? How does it stay highly contextual and highly relevant? And I think whether you have a physical or a digital experience, as long as you're contextual and relevant, it will be a meaningful engagement. And I think that is what will drive the success of financial services. It's not whether or not you've got a new bank sign out in...

...front of your branch. It's not whether you've got a, you know, a large market presence, which is often defined by not just your market itself, but the number of locations in the market. If you're actually out there leveraging data and building experiences that are meaningful, you're going to succeed, and I think that 2020 is a set up for success. In 2021 I'm seeing an increase in in dedication to digital channels. The P P. P. Lending thing is a great example. You know, what Jill Castilla and Mark Cuban did is a perfect example. It took an outsider like Mark Cuban to say Holy crap, But we need to create a destination for small business to go to, to get clarity on what the hell the government is saying. Right? That's a great point. That's a great point to get clarity because, you know, from the consumer perspective, whether you're, you know, an individual, you know, head of household business owner. I think there's so much more confusion from that perspective, that is where into your point with Jill. That's where we as bankers, are able to come in to provide clarity and really hope that you don't have to stay stuck here, right? Right. No, you don't. Yeah, I think banks and crayons. We're learning new tricks. They realize that. And I'm looking at, like, the hires they're going on out there in the industry right now in the banking space they're not looking for your traditional worker right there. They're hiring people that are. I don't want to say digital natives, but they're hiring people that understand engagement from a more holistic point of view and, you know, even the retail bankers. But I know that have large branch networks are looking for different kinds of people, there is a cultural impact, the revolution that might be occurring in light of maybe co vid. Or it could just...

...simply be because, you know, technology is advancing so quickly. That's a great point. The idea of attracting recruiting and really retaining talent for digital growth. Where are these hires being made from? Is it from the industry? Are we looking now outside of the industry and bringing people in who might not necessarily be jaded by the past of banking? Yeah, I can probably comment more from a scientific point of view there, looking outside the industry. Some of the bankers I know are looking for non bankers as well, because they're looking for a different perspective. Even in the eighties, we went through a period where we have the supermarket branches popping up when I was a core states and we had supermarket branches. We actually were recruiting Cheney. Two storms. Remember Kenny Shoe stores? Yeah, I remember my mom taking me there and getting fit with the little metal thing and way recruited from them because these were people that were hungry that were taught in the store to a approach the customers. So we had people that were in the supermarkets or excuse for shoe salesman selling product of these supermarche supermarket branches. I'm not suggesting we're gonna be bringing shoe stores back or anything like that, but there's definitely an advantage looking outside the market to break the norm because the bank of yesterday is not going to be the bank tomorrow. But what you just said is that's a key insight right there. We were hiring people from Kinney's shoe store to take a proactive stance in someone's buying journey. The same can be true in the digital space to where I think a lot of financial brands are still in a reactive mode, waiting for someone thio raise their hand to where we have so much digital signaling going on. We can be that Kenny's shoes salesman from the...

...context of Digital to take a proactive stance in their life and, you know, and really help help them through that journey before somebody even aware of where they're at right now. Yeah, it's 2021 is gonna be an interesting year. I mean, we just started the second round of this P p. P. Loan thing. I think it's over $200 billion. It's available. So you see, the joke is still is out there, you know, jumping on it. Numerator to fintech companies all over it. Memphis is developing some products. They've already got a lending platform in place. You know, it's we learned a lesson just from the PP to loan experience from a retail delivery point of view. So that thing is going to continue the propofol. I think the industry will be a little more digitally savvy and a little more relevant. Hopefully, we'll learn some valuable experiences from that. I think the payment in this reason to be another one that's going to be exciting next year or this year. Keep forgetting. It's hard to believe it's 2021 right? But you know there's gonna be a lot that's occurring in the payment space. Another one is crypto currency. Yeah, right now we have remarkable volatility I haven't looked at. I think in the last two days it's popped up in back about 12 or 15%. It raises that. But you know, banks are going to start offering Bitcoin non traditional financials like Mass Mutual and Prudential will probably start offering Bitcoin the number one term searched on Charles Schwab's website last week. It was Bitcoin okay. It's not 80 year olds and 70 year olds that are doing those searches. It's millennials and younger that we're doing that Kids My, my, my kids aged 23 21. So yeah, there's gonna be a lot that happens in a short period of time. 2021 is going to be honest. It is gonna be a really good year. Yeah, I agree. A lot of opportunity on the flip side of the coin, the Bitcoin, if you will. What are you gonna be? Some of the roadblocks, the challenges for...

...financial brand leaders as well as Fintech leaders to be aware of that they don't get tripped up and get stuck. I think it would be the same ones we've always had, you know, a certain level of apathy. The industry is the whole because it's such a commoditized industry is and somewhat fat, dumb and happy. I think there's a rude awakening occurring right now. Well, we also didn't touch on, you know, this fiscal need. I mean, you know, we're in a zero interest rate market right now, so bankers have got to find a new way to make a living, in essence, out the balance sheets, not going to correct itself. The economy is still a mess alone demands gonna have. There's gonna be an impact on that. You know, they're gonna have to become more efficient and deliver product in, um, or in a better and more meaningful way. Technology has transformed our world, and digital has changed the way consumers shop for and buy financial services forever. Now, consumers make purchase decisions long before they walk into a branch if they walk into a branch at all. But your financial brand still wants to grow loans and deposits. We get it. Digital growth can feel confusing, frustrating and overwhelming for any financial brand marketing and sales leader. But it doesn't have thio because James Robert wrote the book that guides you every step of the way along your digital growth journey. Visit www dot digital growth dot com to get a preview of his best selling book, Banking on Digital Growth, Or order a copy right now for you and your team from Amazon. Inside you'll find a strategic marketing manifesto that was written to transform financial brands, and it is packed full of practical and proven insights you can start using today to confidently generate 10 times more loans and deposits. Now back to the show. Thoughts on because we're talking new new income streams, new revenue...

...streams, Thoughts on because this has been a big area of just thinking for me personally, uh, monetizing some type of financial coaching on I don't want to say Financial Advisor, because that's a whole other area in and of itself, more from an investment standpoint, but just more of coaching, because if we're looking at helping people to better themselves financially, there's a lot of the need to change patterns behaviors that are rooted in, you know, early childhood environment. Is there a way like a gym can charge, You know, for some type of coaching training, and it's not even financial literacy or financial education. It's deeper than that. Is there an opportunity to monetize and create revenue around developing some type of A program like that, particularly when combined with fintech or combined with some type of data and analytics insight? I mean, I think there is. I mean, I know in the and the wealthier segments you've got Strategic Asset Management and they monetize it through a flat fee who were from 1 to 2.5% of assets under managers under management. And then you've got a number of financial wellness solutions out there that you can subscribe to today. I'm not seeing them offered by banks. I saw today that alliance has done a partnership with Susie or or Zeman Orman better name, which is kind of interesting. I'm not sure if I know enough about it to comment on it, but at least they're They're saying we want to be a financial advocate and we're going to surround us with people that will help us truly become that because for decades the industry, not just the credit Union Street with the banking industry, has made that promise that we will be a financial advocate. They haven't really acted upon it not nearly as much as I probably could, but again, I go back to P p p. Lending people get community banks a rough time. Prior to this, the community bankers really came out as heroes in most cases when it came to P P P lending because it got...

...out there self educated and they took a stance that took the time to educate. It will be the advocate of small business, and that's still going on the danger. The danger is that if if we do what we did back in the nineties and the tooth early two thousands, where we started declaring, we had financial literacy programs and we basically were calling people financially illiterate and doing that this this program is fundamentally did not work. But there is an opportunity to create programs and coaching that is maybe a subscription based product. I don't know if it will be a bank that will do it, or it will be a fintech that'll do it. But it's possible people pay today for, you know, diet solutions, right? Like like newme. I think it is on and then you've got you've got all these psychology APS now that help you? You look at your iPhone. It tells you when you ought to breathe. I mean, yeah, there's there's probably something out there for it. You know, we subscribe for health fitness. Why not physical fitness? Yeah, because the physical fitness has such a direct correlation impact on the physical fitness and even the mental well being. And it's like I just see the opportunity. If you fix someone's wallet, then you naturally will improve both their their physical well being as well as their mental well being. So maybe there's even some cross industry collaborations with, and I agree with you. It is a subscription based model. We're seeing that with the financial gym at Based out of New York, who's got a lot of good publicity and press, and I think they have a membership model of about $100 a month. But the value creation is they're saving their members on average, and it's funny when you talk about members you think credit unions, but they're saving their members on average, $6000 through that financial coaching and advisory there increase increasing credit scores by 50 to 75 points, which creates much, much more, longer term value. So ah, lot of this, that there is the reality. I think the time is now...

...toe to put that insight into action. There's a lot of research that I've been reviewing that is hitting back at financial education because it creates a false sense of confidence, just like Google creates a false sense of confidence. Whenever you go and you google your your symptoms, you can, you know, self diagnosed. But you're probably gonna be wrong. And so that's where I feel like the expertise off financial services of Fintech can really start to show itself and and rise to your point of beyond the commoditization. You mentioned something, the complacency. I call it the cave of complacency where people are just stuck there. They feel it's safe and secure, but it's a false sense of security. What can be done to inspire those? And there's maybe even some leaders who are still stuck in the cave of complacency. What can be done to inspire them to come out, to explore toe toe, to reach what I call the apex of awareness and look ahead towards the future with hope. I think the first thing is to look outside the industry. Don't rely upon this tree. Trade associations, education. You know they tend to have kind of a tunnel vision approach. Sometimes that said, you know, I look at a B A and after, and they're increasingly investing in tech and trying to drive Mawr environments of collaboration. I think of the industry confined inspiration outside. It's ah, it's realm. I think that's gonna be a true benefit. And I'm not talking about looking at Starbucks because not even Starbucks wants to be Starbucks anymore about looking Atmore more aggressively. If the Amazons of the World you know how to leverage data and deliver product, there's just a lot of inspiring organizations that could do something. I want to go back to financial literacy real quick, though. You know one thing, one of things I think that's gonna happen in 2021. I hate to bring up the word political because of the situation we're in today. Financial health is going to get political right. It's going to get very...

...political, financial health scores or something that people are now starting to talk about, and I think what that's going to do is that's gonna lead to an increase financial health, regulatory environment that may. I'm not saying it'll stifle the ability of banks to truly an act upon advocacy, but it is going to create somewhat of a speed bump it'll probably create with ones that have the insight and have the marketing wherewithal. It probably will present itself with opportunity. They can distinguish themselves from the competition. But let's let's rest assured there's gonna be some regular for challenges or banks next year, and some of it's gonna be tied to all of those the politicalization of financial health. Yeah, if you know when when we look out at this year, a lot of opportunities, a lot of, you know, potential roadblocks to be aware of. If there is one thing I'm a financial brand leader, what would be the one thing that you would advise be to focus on so that it's December 31 2021 we look back on this year, I've made really good progress. If there was one thing that I could just keep my eye on and not get distracted by all of the noise going on, What would that one thing be for focus? Yeah, I'm I'm biased towards Fintech, you know? So I would say a knopper to nitty that I'd like bankers to look back and say, Hey, I really move the needle. There would be considering Fintech as a service platform. You know, I think that they're gonna be there's gonna be some real emergence there again. I think the world's between Fintech and fencer. We're going to somewhat collide. It's not a new concept, you know. Obviously it's been used quite a bit, but with all the evolving opportunities that exist with B. A s banking as a service AP eyes the open banking movement that we're kind of in there's going opportunity for banks to really diversify the products...

...and services that they offer. So I guess what I would ask a banker to dio in December 31 2001, look back and say what new products and services that I bring to market And how relevant were they and did they make me money? E gotta add that for profit part in there? Absolutely, absolutely. And and I think to your point here when we look at this idea of fintech Finn serv financial brand collaboration from your lens of the world. What is what is one commonly held industry belief that you really passionately disagree with the context of threat? I still talk to people out there that they're kind of have this Whoa is me mentality, you know. Oh, my goodness. The challenger banks were coming. I could never be like them. The new bank should come. I could never be like them, but maybe I don't need to worry about. Well, the bottom line is you do you know, if you're in, uh, Edmonds, Oklahoma. And, uh, you're a millennial customer today. You can bank a chime. You don't have bank of Jill's bank. You know, even though it's a great bank, people like Jill are looking to say what new products and services can bring to the market that, you know, reduce the shore banking that are, um, you know, really demonstrating unique in meaningful or relevant experience. Is that more of a mindset issue? I mean, it's a mindset, but it's also, you know, I think we're victims in the industry of that commoditization mindset. You know, if if we if we view banking as a commodity. What? What inspires us to be different? You know, we tend to look within our own industry for for, um, inspiration. That's that's a mistake. So this is really about almost what I would look at his first principles. Thinking of, you know, going back to zero, which is what has driven, you know, great. Probably the greatest example of this in modern time...

...is Elon Musk, you know, with both Tesla as well Space six. Because we lose all assumptions we like. We go back to zero and we start over. We don't look at the limitations. We look at the opportunities that are available for us. And with that in mind, you know, financial brand leaders. What is the best way for them to overcome to break free from the past, to deal with change in the present moment and really eliminate some of the fears that might be holding them back from moving towards this future that you and others were talking about? Some of this has to do with with risk taking. If this change is being driven by by marketing in retail delivery, which is usually where it has driven the average financial institutions, Let's say 10 billion bucks and under which the bulkier in that category, obviously you know. So it's you know, they need to have a sit down with their board and their executive leadership to understand the tolerance of risk. What can, how much latitude or you're gonna give me to try new things. I think that's a big part of it, because there's a fear. You know, the average bank marketer today is Johnny on the spot for the lending department. We need a loan promotion. That's what they're hearing day in and day out. When I was a Jeezy, people said, I love what you're talking about. Brian, your sales team has done a great job. But you know what? How does it make loans for me? I get that all they're hearing has given loans, right? Right now, you're not going to get the loan volume you want with a piece of pie you want. You're gonna have to have a bigger piece of pie or um, or targeted piece of pie in order to maintain that lending opportunities. But now you got new threats. You've got in text, neo banks and really really smart bankers out there. They're doing and trying new things, but understand the risk following innovation, it really goes back to the kidneys. Shoe example of taking a proactive stance. Yeah, a horrible, A horrible example in many...

...ways, but literally, that's what we did. You know, we went a shoe store where the sales reps were comped on pursuing the customer to make sure they engage them in order to close the sale and get him a parachute. That, well, you know, one of one of my very first jobs was working at Old Navy, and this was when Old Navy was coming into the Houston market. I think I was like, 17, 18 years old at the time, and I was the second round of hires in the old Navy store that I was in. We ended up growing to become the number one selling Old Navy in the entire country, and it was because we had this amazing cells. It's so simple, you know, very similar to your your kidneys shoes, for example. You approach the customer as they walk into the doors. You have your blue bag in hand, and you asked if you could walk around the store and shop with them to provide the guidance and expertise. And and and you're like, Well, it's just buying clothes. Well, you're there. If someone needs that guidance, you're there. If someone needs that advice, if they want to do it on their own, that's great. But at least you're taking a proactive stance versus waiting for someone toe feel some level of friction that you talk so passionately about our frustration and eliminate that before it even exist. Yeah, well, listen, Brian, this has been such a great conversation. If someone wants to continue this conversation, this dialogue with you to dive, to dive deeper into the opportunities of Fintech Finn serv financial brand collaboration and the opportunities that exist because it is really your passion, your area of focus, what's the best way for them to reach out? Connect with you? Say hello, Hit me on, get me on Twitter at Claggett or just find me on LinkedIn that Brian Claggett, B R Y a and C L A G P. Excellent. Excellent. Brian, thanks again for joining me on another episode of banking on growth and as always, and until next time be Well, do good and...

...wash your hands. Thank you for listening to another episode of banking on Digital Growth with James Robert Ley. Like what you hear. Tell a friend about the podcast and leave us a review on Apple podcasts, Google Podcast or Spotify and subscribe while you're there. To get even more practical and proven insights, visit www dot digital growth dot com to grab a preview of James Roberts bestselling book Banking on Digital Growth or order a copy right now for you and your team from Amazon. Inside, you'll find a strategic marketing and sales blueprint framed around 12 key areas of focus that empower you to confidently generate 10 times more loans and deposits until next time, be well and do good.

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