Banking on Digital Growth
Banking on Digital Growth

Episode · 11 months ago

65) #ExponentialInsights: Bank of Tomorrow: Why We Should Look Outside the Industry w/ Bryan Clagett

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

It’s not hard to see the financial industry has become stifled.

It’s a victim of its own success and the commoditization of its products.

And to fix it, we need to look outside the industry.

In today’s episode, I’m joined by Bryan Clagett, Chief Revenue Officer (CRO) at Moven, to talk about why financial brands would do well to look for inspiration from outside the market.

We discuss:

  • Why innovation has slowed in the financial industry
  • How other industries may be the key to solving the problem
  • What the future of finance — and fintech, in particular — looks like

You can find this interview, and many more, by subscribing to Banking on Digital Growth on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or here.
 

...on your visibility out in the marketand how Maney prospects you're actually visiting. That's really not a goodmetric. Necessarily. It's the quality of the engagement a council you're listening to. Banking on DigitalGrowth with James Robert Lay, a podcast that empowers financial brand marketing,sales and leadership teams to maximize their digital growth potential bygenerating 10 times more loans and deposits. Today's episode is part ofthe exponential insight Siri's, where James Robert interviews the industry'stop marketing sales, and Fintech leaders sharing practical wisdom toeexponentially elevate you and your team. Let's get into the show. Greetings inHello, I Am James Robert Ley and welcome to the 65th episode of theBanking on Digital Growth podcast. Today's episode is part of theexponential insight Siri's and I'm excited to welcome Brian. Clog it tothe show. Brian is a strategic leader helping Fintech and Finn serv whenmarket share, who most recently drove G Zeos marketing efforts as the CMO andinvestor helping to sell the company to Jack Henry and Associates in July of2019. Since then, Brian has taken up advisory roles at Channel Net BlipNimbus, in addition to running badass banking on a mission to help banks,credit unions and fintech create a better financial services experiencefor both consumers and business. Hello, Brian. And welcome to the show today.Good to see you, my man. I am I am is good to see you. I'm always thrilled tobe on your show and just sometimes just catch up with you. Yeah, it is alwaysgood. You know, it's been over 10 years now since we first connected and havehad a lot of good conversations, good experiences presenting together overthe years and sharing knowledge and insight. And and that's really my hopetoday is just, uh, transfer knowledge...

Thio the dear listener from your lensof the world. And what, your dear listener, that sounds very North Korean.The D Oh, dear listener. Um, no, no, no, no North Korea happening over here. Butwhen we look at and reflecting back on 2020 just for you personally, whatwould have been some of the biggest lessons that have come out of the what?I'm calling the 2020 experience? Well, I worked with a lot of brands in, uh,2020 and I think when we started this experiment will call it or experienceback in March. I think people are really panicked right on day. And Ithink there was a fear that it wasn't just a fear of the disease but a fearof the economic collapse. And obviously things have been tough for millions inAmerica. And I think a lot of bankers, the credit union folks included in theFrontex were really worried that their physical presence was gonna cause abuzzer demise. And, you know, they're gonna They're gonna have a culturalfallout from a staffing point of view because we went from seeing people inoffices to having these, you know, work from home experiences. What I'velearned work from home has actually done great. Ah, lot of people arereally benefiting from it. I think some organizations are stronger because ofit. Even culturally, I think there's been a remarkable amount ofproductivity that's come out of some of these financial institutions. Certainlythe thin texts and we adapted right, and another lesson learned was the factthat it's not just the younger folks out there, the millennials that areadopting technology, it's, you know, old sparks like me and and you know Geny Gen x. You know, they're all out there and they're using technology, andthey're finding that it's pretty darn easy. And the bankers were realizingthey don't have to have the same...

...physical attributes they always had.They actually can survive in a digital world. You know, I think back in inhearing your reflection, this idea of the physical versus the digital worldand some of the fear. I mean, I was launching a book in 2020 and had all ofthese big plans and book tours, and then all of that got shut down. But Igotta tell you, I was way more efficient, way more productive in thisdigital zoom conversation world. I don't No, if I want to go back to theway things were before because we've seen so much opportunity as it standstoday, what I'd like to get back and meet people again in the world, youknow, give him a hug and shake their hand? Absolutely. But I think there'sgonna be a balance. It's like way gotta find this new. Thats new level ofcomfort. What do your thoughts on that? No, I think you're right. I think it'sa balance. I mean, you know, when I was a strategy core and I spent a year withthem, just about I love those guys, great product. But I was spending a lotof time in airports. Andi, that was There was a lot of downtime. Granted,I'm addicted to social, and I'm you know, I'm always firing out emails andmessages, so maybe I'm a little more productive than theatrics. Person is inan airport, But that was time down. The time I'm spending now, and the timethat I see a lot of the sales guys that I know they're no longer quote unquoteon the road. You know, they're they're still productive, you know, they'remeeting as many people, maybe even Mawr. I think the harder challenge is how tomake those interactions quality oriented. It's not just a quantityissue, but if you're a sales guy, you know, sometimes your success ismeasured on on your visibility out in the market and how maney prospectsyou're actually visiting. That's really not a good metric. Necessarily. It'sthe quality of the engagement accounts, and ultimately you know, it's theimpact you have meaning? Are you...

...driving sales? I think there's, youknow, a lot of truth with that. Because personally speaking, you know, I'veenjoyed being able to advise, you know, top 15 over in Europe. Uh, then hopover to the Caribbean and then go over tow California all in one day on gohome and sleep in my bed at night so and and actually get quality sleep andsee my wife see my kids. But then I also think, you know, from the lens I'ma c l o. You know, I'm a lending ml Oi! I have my own book of businesscommercial lending at a bank. What bu I can't go play golf anymore, But I canget on linked in and, you know, make all of these connections and have BJ.Paultre and I were talking about this on a previous episode and be a lot moreefficient, but it takes a different mindset. It takes a differentoperational model, and and it really forces us to look for the opportunitiesthat we might not have ever considered before. When we were on the golf course,spending four or five hours with, you know, three other people. When we lookat those opportunities, particularly from the work that you're doing thecollaboration between financial brand and fintech, what are thoseopportunities that you see in 2021 beyond? Well, I think that I think itgoes back to theme that I've always believed in. And that's just this, uh,concept of engagement banking how Toe Bankers and credit. You know, I wouldsay Bankers Right Credit union years bankers the same thing. How doesfinancial the financial industry? The financial services industry is thewhole? How does it stay highly contextual and highly relevant? And Ithink whether you have a physical or a digital experience, as long as you'recontextual and relevant, it will be a meaningful engagement. And I think thatis what will drive the success of financial services. It's not whether ornot you've got a new bank sign out in...

...front of your branch. It's not whetheryou've got a, you know, a large market presence, which is often defined by notjust your market itself, but the number of locations in the market. If you'reactually out there leveraging data and building experiences that aremeaningful, you're going to succeed, and I think that 2020 is a set up forsuccess. In 2021 I'm seeing an increase in in dedication to digital channels.The P P. P. Lending thing is a great example. You know, what Jill Castillaand Mark Cuban did is a perfect example. It took an outsider like Mark Cuban tosay Holy crap, But we need to create a destination for small business to go to,to get clarity on what the hell the government is saying. Right? That's agreat point. That's a great point to get clarity because, you know, from theconsumer perspective, whether you're, you know, an individual, you know, headof household business owner. I think there's so much more confusion fromthat perspective, that is where into your point with Jill. That's where weas bankers, are able to come in to provide clarity and really hope thatyou don't have to stay stuck here, right? Right. No, you don't. Yeah, Ithink banks and crayons. We're learning new tricks. They realize that. And I'mlooking at, like, the hires they're going on out there in the industryright now in the banking space they're not looking for your traditional workerright there. They're hiring people that are. I don't want to say digitalnatives, but they're hiring people that understand engagement from a moreholistic point of view and, you know, even the retail bankers. But I knowthat have large branch networks are looking for different kinds of people,there is a cultural impact, the revolution that might be occurring inlight of maybe co vid. Or it could just...

...simply be because, you know, technologyis advancing so quickly. That's a great point. The idea of attractingrecruiting and really retaining talent for digital growth. Where are thesehires being made from? Is it from the industry? Are we looking now outside ofthe industry and bringing people in who might not necessarily be jaded by thepast of banking? Yeah, I can probably comment more from a scientific point ofview there, looking outside the industry. Some of the bankers I knoware looking for non bankers as well, because they're looking for a differentperspective. Even in the eighties, we went through a period where we have thesupermarket branches popping up when I was a core states and we hadsupermarket branches. We actually were recruiting Cheney. Two storms. RememberKenny Shoe stores? Yeah, I remember my mom taking me there and getting fitwith the little metal thing and way recruited from them because these werepeople that were hungry that were taught in the store to a approach thecustomers. So we had people that were in the supermarkets or excuse for shoesalesman selling product of these supermarche supermarket branches. I'mnot suggesting we're gonna be bringing shoe stores back or anything like that,but there's definitely an advantage looking outside the market to break thenorm because the bank of yesterday is not going to be the bank tomorrow. Butwhat you just said is that's a key insight right there. We were hiringpeople from Kinney's shoe store to take a proactive stance in someone's buyingjourney. The same can be true in the digital space to where I think a lot offinancial brands are still in a reactive mode, waiting for someone thioraise their hand to where we have so much digital signaling going on. We canbe that Kenny's shoes salesman from the...

...context of Digital to take a proactivestance in their life and, you know, and really help help them through thatjourney before somebody even aware of where they're at right now. Yeah, it's2021 is gonna be an interesting year. I mean, we just started the second roundof this P p. P. Loan thing. I think it's over $200 billion. It's available.So you see, the joke is still is out there, you know, jumping on it.Numerator to fintech companies all over it. Memphis is developing some products.They've already got a lending platform in place. You know, it's we learned alesson just from the PP to loan experience from a retail delivery pointof view. So that thing is going to continue the propofol. I think theindustry will be a little more digitally savvy and a little morerelevant. Hopefully, we'll learn some valuable experiences from that. I thinkthe payment in this reason to be another one that's going to be excitingnext year or this year. Keep forgetting. It's hard to believe it's 2021 right?But you know there's gonna be a lot that's occurring in the payment space.Another one is crypto currency. Yeah, right now we have remarkable volatilityI haven't looked at. I think in the last two days it's popped up in backabout 12 or 15%. It raises that. But you know, banks are going to startoffering Bitcoin non traditional financials like Mass Mutual andPrudential will probably start offering Bitcoin the number one term searched onCharles Schwab's website last week. It was Bitcoin okay. It's not 80 year oldsand 70 year olds that are doing those searches. It's millennials and youngerthat we're doing that Kids My, my, my kids aged 23 21. So yeah, there's gonnabe a lot that happens in a short period of time. 2021 is going to be honest. Itis gonna be a really good year. Yeah, I agree. A lot of opportunity on the flipside of the coin, the Bitcoin, if you will. What are you gonna be? Some ofthe roadblocks, the challenges for...

...financial brand leaders as well asFintech leaders to be aware of that they don't get tripped up and get stuck.I think it would be the same ones we've always had, you know, a certain levelof apathy. The industry is the whole because it's such a commoditizedindustry is and somewhat fat, dumb and happy. I think there's a rude awakeningoccurring right now. Well, we also didn't touch on, you know, this fiscalneed. I mean, you know, we're in a zero interest rate market right now, sobankers have got to find a new way to make a living, in essence, out thebalance sheets, not going to correct itself. The economy is still a messalone demands gonna have. There's gonna be an impact on that. You know, they'regonna have to become more efficient and deliver product in, um, or in a betterand more meaningful way. Technology has transformed our world, and digital haschanged the way consumers shop for and buy financial services forever. Now,consumers make purchase decisions long before they walk into a branch if theywalk into a branch at all. But your financial brand still wants to growloans and deposits. We get it. Digital growth can feel confusing, frustratingand overwhelming for any financial brand marketing and sales leader. Butit doesn't have thio because James Robert wrote the book that guides youevery step of the way along your digital growth journey. Visit www dotdigital growth dot com to get a preview of his best selling book, Banking onDigital Growth, Or order a copy right now for you and your team from Amazon.Inside you'll find a strategic marketing manifesto that was written totransform financial brands, and it is packed full of practical and proveninsights you can start using today to confidently generate 10 times moreloans and deposits. Now back to the show. Thoughts on because we're talkingnew new income streams, new revenue...

...streams, Thoughts on because this hasbeen a big area of just thinking for me personally, uh, monetizing some type offinancial coaching on I don't want to say Financial Advisor, because that's awhole other area in and of itself, more from an investment standpoint, but justmore of coaching, because if we're looking at helping people to betterthemselves financially, there's a lot of the need to change patternsbehaviors that are rooted in, you know, early childhood environment. Is there away like a gym can charge, You know, for some type of coaching training, andit's not even financial literacy or financial education. It's deeper thanthat. Is there an opportunity to monetize and create revenue arounddeveloping some type of A program like that, particularly when combined withfintech or combined with some type of data and analytics insight? I mean, Ithink there is. I mean, I know in the and the wealthier segments you've gotStrategic Asset Management and they monetize it through a flat fee who werefrom 1 to 2.5% of assets under managers under management. And then you've got anumber of financial wellness solutions out there that you can subscribe totoday. I'm not seeing them offered by banks. I saw today that alliance hasdone a partnership with Susie or or Zeman Orman better name, which is kindof interesting. I'm not sure if I know enough about it to comment on it, butat least they're They're saying we want to be a financial advocate and we'regoing to surround us with people that will help us truly become that becausefor decades the industry, not just the credit Union Street with the bankingindustry, has made that promise that we will be a financial advocate. Theyhaven't really acted upon it not nearly as much as I probably could, but again,I go back to P p p. Lending people get community banks a rough time. Prior tothis, the community bankers really came out as heroes in most cases when itcame to P P P lending because it got...

...out there self educated and they took astance that took the time to educate. It will be the advocate of smallbusiness, and that's still going on the danger. The danger is that if if we dowhat we did back in the nineties and the tooth early two thousands, where westarted declaring, we had financial literacy programs and we basically werecalling people financially illiterate and doing that this this program isfundamentally did not work. But there is an opportunity to create programsand coaching that is maybe a subscription based product. I don'tknow if it will be a bank that will do it, or it will be a fintech that'll doit. But it's possible people pay today for, you know, diet solutions, right?Like like newme. I think it is on and then you've got you've got all thesepsychology APS now that help you? You look at your iPhone. It tells you whenyou ought to breathe. I mean, yeah, there's there's probably something outthere for it. You know, we subscribe for health fitness. Why not physicalfitness? Yeah, because the physical fitness has such a direct correlationimpact on the physical fitness and even the mental well being. And it's like Ijust see the opportunity. If you fix someone's wallet, then you naturallywill improve both their their physical well being as well as their mental wellbeing. So maybe there's even some cross industry collaborations with, and Iagree with you. It is a subscription based model. We're seeing that with thefinancial gym at Based out of New York, who's got a lot of good publicity andpress, and I think they have a membership model of about $100 a month.But the value creation is they're saving their members on average, andit's funny when you talk about members you think credit unions, but they'resaving their members on average, $6000 through that financial coaching andadvisory there increase increasing credit scores by 50 to 75 points, whichcreates much, much more, longer term value. So ah, lot of this, that thereis the reality. I think the time is now...

...toe to put that insight into action.There's a lot of research that I've been reviewing that is hitting back atfinancial education because it creates a false sense of confidence, just likeGoogle creates a false sense of confidence. Whenever you go and yougoogle your your symptoms, you can, you know, self diagnosed. But you'reprobably gonna be wrong. And so that's where I feel like the expertise offfinancial services of Fintech can really start to show itself and andrise to your point of beyond the commoditization. You mentionedsomething, the complacency. I call it the cave of complacency where peopleare just stuck there. They feel it's safe and secure, but it's a false senseof security. What can be done to inspire those? And there's maybe evensome leaders who are still stuck in the cave of complacency. What can be doneto inspire them to come out, to explore toe toe, to reach what I call the apexof awareness and look ahead towards the future with hope. I think the firstthing is to look outside the industry. Don't rely upon this tree. Tradeassociations, education. You know they tend to have kind of a tunnel visionapproach. Sometimes that said, you know, I look at a B A and after, and they'reincreasingly investing in tech and trying to drive Mawr environments ofcollaboration. I think of the industry confined inspiration outside. It's ah,it's realm. I think that's gonna be a true benefit. And I'm not talking aboutlooking at Starbucks because not even Starbucks wants to be Starbucks anymoreabout looking Atmore more aggressively. If the Amazons of the World you knowhow to leverage data and deliver product, there's just a lot ofinspiring organizations that could do something. I want to go back tofinancial literacy real quick, though. You know one thing, one of things Ithink that's gonna happen in 2021. I hate to bring up the word politicalbecause of the situation we're in today. Financial health is going to getpolitical right. It's going to get very...

...political, financial health scores orsomething that people are now starting to talk about, and I think what that'sgoing to do is that's gonna lead to an increase financial health, regulatoryenvironment that may. I'm not saying it'll stifle the ability of banks totruly an act upon advocacy, but it is going to create somewhat of a speedbump it'll probably create with ones that have the insight and have themarketing wherewithal. It probably will present itself with opportunity. Theycan distinguish themselves from the competition. But let's let's restassured there's gonna be some regular for challenges or banks next year, andsome of it's gonna be tied to all of those the politicalization of financialhealth. Yeah, if you know when when we look out at this year, a lot ofopportunities, a lot of, you know, potential roadblocks to be aware of. If there is one thing I'm a financialbrand leader, what would be the one thing that you would advise be to focuson so that it's December 31 2021 we look back on this year, I've madereally good progress. If there was one thing that I could just keep my eye onand not get distracted by all of the noise going on, What would that onething be for focus? Yeah, I'm I'm biased towards Fintech,you know? So I would say a knopper to nitty that I'd like bankers to lookback and say, Hey, I really move the needle. There would be consideringFintech as a service platform. You know, I think that they're gonna be there'sgonna be some real emergence there again. I think the world's betweenFintech and fencer. We're going to somewhat collide. It's not a newconcept, you know. Obviously it's been used quite a bit, but with all theevolving opportunities that exist with B. A s banking as a service AP eyes theopen banking movement that we're kind of in there's going opportunity forbanks to really diversify the products...

...and services that they offer. So Iguess what I would ask a banker to dio in December 31 2001, look back and saywhat new products and services that I bring to market And how relevant werethey and did they make me money? E gotta add that for profit part in there?Absolutely, absolutely. And and I think to your point here when we look at thisidea of fintech Finn serv financial brand collaboration from your lens ofthe world. What is what is one commonly held industry belief that you reallypassionately disagree with the context of threat? I still talk to people outthere that they're kind of have this Whoa is me mentality, you know. Oh, mygoodness. The challenger banks were coming. I could never be like them. Thenew bank should come. I could never be like them, but maybe I don't need toworry about. Well, the bottom line is you do you know, if you're in, uh,Edmonds, Oklahoma. And, uh, you're a millennial customer today. You can banka chime. You don't have bank of Jill's bank. You know, even though it's agreat bank, people like Jill are looking to say what new products andservices can bring to the market that, you know, reduce the shore banking thatare, um, you know, really demonstrating unique in meaningful or relevantexperience. Is that more of a mindset issue? I mean, it's a mindset, but it'salso, you know, I think we're victims in the industry of that commoditizationmindset. You know, if if we if we view banking as a commodity. What? Whatinspires us to be different? You know, we tend to look within our own industryfor for, um, inspiration. That's that's a mistake. So this is really aboutalmost what I would look at his first principles. Thinking of, you know,going back to zero, which is what has driven, you know, great. Probably thegreatest example of this in modern time...

...is Elon Musk, you know, with both Teslaas well Space six. Because we lose all assumptions we like. We go back to zeroand we start over. We don't look at the limitations. We look at theopportunities that are available for us. And with that in mind, you know,financial brand leaders. What is the best way for them to overcome to breakfree from the past, to deal with change in the present moment and reallyeliminate some of the fears that might be holding them back from movingtowards this future that you and others were talking about? Some of this has todo with with risk taking. If this change is being driven by by marketingin retail delivery, which is usually where it has driven the averagefinancial institutions, Let's say 10 billion bucks and under which thebulkier in that category, obviously you know. So it's you know, they need tohave a sit down with their board and their executive leadership tounderstand the tolerance of risk. What can, how much latitude or you're gonnagive me to try new things. I think that's a big part of it, becausethere's a fear. You know, the average bank marketer today is Johnny on thespot for the lending department. We need a loan promotion. That's whatthey're hearing day in and day out. When I was a Jeezy, people said, I lovewhat you're talking about. Brian, your sales team has done a great job. Butyou know what? How does it make loans for me? I get that all they're hearinghas given loans, right? Right now, you're not going to get the loan volumeyou want with a piece of pie you want. You're gonna have to have a biggerpiece of pie or um, or targeted piece of pie in order to maintain thatlending opportunities. But now you got new threats. You've got in text, neobanks and really really smart bankers out there. They're doing and trying newthings, but understand the risk following innovation, it really goesback to the kidneys. Shoe example of taking a proactive stance. Yeah, ahorrible, A horrible example in many...

...ways, but literally, that's what we did.You know, we went a shoe store where the sales reps were comped on pursuingthe customer to make sure they engage them in order to close the sale and gethim a parachute. That, well, you know, one of one of my very first jobs wasworking at Old Navy, and this was when Old Navy was coming into the Houstonmarket. I think I was like, 17, 18 years old at the time, and I was thesecond round of hires in the old Navy store that I was in. We ended upgrowing to become the number one selling Old Navy in the entire country,and it was because we had this amazing cells. It's so simple, you know, verysimilar to your your kidneys shoes, for example. You approach the customer asthey walk into the doors. You have your blue bag in hand, and you asked if youcould walk around the store and shop with them to provide the guidance andexpertise. And and and you're like, Well, it's just buying clothes. Well,you're there. If someone needs that guidance, you're there. If someoneneeds that advice, if they want to do it on their own, that's great. But atleast you're taking a proactive stance versus waiting for someone toe feelsome level of friction that you talk so passionately about our frustration andeliminate that before it even exist. Yeah, well, listen, Brian, this hasbeen such a great conversation. If someone wants to continue thisconversation, this dialogue with you to dive, to dive deeper into theopportunities of Fintech Finn serv financial brand collaboration and theopportunities that exist because it is really your passion, your area of focus,what's the best way for them to reach out? Connect with you? Say hello, Hitme on, get me on Twitter at Claggett or just find me on LinkedIn that BrianClaggett, B R Y a and C L A G P. Excellent. Excellent. Brian, thanksagain for joining me on another episode of banking on growth and as always, anduntil next time be Well, do good and...

...wash your hands. Thank you forlistening to another episode of banking on Digital Growth with James Robert Ley.Like what you hear. Tell a friend about the podcast and leave us a review onApple podcasts, Google Podcast or Spotify and subscribe while you'rethere. To get even more practical and proven insights, visit www dot digitalgrowth dot com to grab a preview of James Roberts bestselling book Bankingon Digital Growth or order a copy right now for you and your team from Amazon.Inside, you'll find a strategic marketing and sales blueprint framedaround 12 key areas of focus that empower you to confidently generate 10times more loans and deposits until next time, be well and do good.

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