Banking on Digital Growth
Banking on Digital Growth

Episode · 3 months ago

200) #InsideDigitalGrowth - Looking Back at 200 Reasons to Bank on the Future and Build Your Personal Brand

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Since our pilot episode two years ago, the world has undergone incredible changes. Yet, we at the Digital Growth Institute remain invested in educating and empowering people burdened by financial stress.

We have had the privilege of gathering positive deposits from the most brilliant minds in our industry. More importantly, our guests share our vision of helping first and selling second - because healthy communities reflect financial institutions that put service above selfishness.

Please join me, James Robert Lay, as I reflect on our transformation journey by revisiting eight memorable exchanges with people using their gifts to help elevate their peers by building personal brands in the banking space.

As always, I encourage you to connect with these remarkable men and women as you continue your digital growth journey.

As always, I encourage you to connect with these remarkable men and women as you continue your digital growth journey.

Only together can we bank on a future worth living in.

Join us as we discuss:

  • Taking a proactive stance in relationship building while continuing to market [9:40]
  • What we can learn from Gary Vaynerchuk in creating our own personal brands — even when working in a regulated industry [17:05]
  • How to start building your personal brand even when the listeners and viewers aren’t showing up. [20:08]   

Check out these resources we mentioned during the podcast:

You can find this interview and many more by subscribing to Banking on Digital Growth on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or here.

Listening on a desktop & can’t see the links? Just search for Banking on Digital Growth in your favorite podcast player.

Greetings in Hello, I am not James Robert Laigh. My Name Is Rob Colin, founder of we sports studios and executive producer of banking on digital growth. I'm normally behind the scenes on the show, but today it's my honor and pleasure to welcome you to the two hundredth episode of banking on digital growth. Over the past two years, James Robert and this show have been taking you on journeys to grow your organization, and today is the day we can officially say that there are hundreds of ways to impact your customer and your community when it comes to being a modern financial brand or Finntech. This podcast has touched so many lives in a time where financial uncertainty is more prevalent than ever. That's what makes banking on digital growth and our dear host James Roberts so special. Their ability to look at things that are bigger than what's in front of us. You've heard him say it before. Make the world one billion times better by guiding one billion people beyond financial stress. Very few podcasts have an actionable goal like that, even fewer make efforts to achieve it every day, and even fewer have the determination and the momentum to last two hundred episodes. The hard work that James Robert and his team at the Digital Growth Institute put into making this show is what is helping to make digital transformation possible for hundreds of financial brands just like yours the world over, and for our part here at Westport Studios, it's both exciting and humbling to play a role in that. So pop the Champagne, put on your favorite headphones and please join me in extending my congratulations to James Robert and his team for an industry leading podcast resource, and be sure to raise a last to yourself, dear listener, for making this not only one of our favorite shows to produce, but also one that has an actual impact on the world. Greetings and hello. I am James Robert Leigh and I'd like to welcome you to the two hundredth episode of the banking on digital growth podcast. This two hundredth episode is part of the inside digital growth series, but it is a special inside digital growth series episode, and not just because it is episode two hundred. It is special because we are bringing together the best of the best when it comes to financial brand marketing and sells, leaders who are leading the way, who are blazing new trails when it comes to building a personal brand through continuous commitment to share their knowledge, to share their insights, to share their expertise with others. Put another way, the leaders and the lenders you will hear today are in fact banking on expertise. And yes, this is the title of Book Number Three that I already have framed out and will start writing once rerelease, banking on change in early two thousand and twenty three. But I am getting too far ahead of the future right now, and my mind a bigger, better and brighter future that I am grateful to have the opportunity to share in creating with you. That there, listener, as we continue to educate and empower financial brands and fintext to generate even more loans and deposits through marketing and sell strategies that improve the financial wellbeing of people, because we believe through the research, the insights, the thinking that we share with financial brands, with fin text, even through this podcast, working and collaborating together, we will all make the world one billion times better by guiding one billion people beyond financial stress towards a bigger, better and brighter future. This podcast is just one way we're doing this and two hundred episodes in. What a journey it has...

...been, a journey that started just shy over two years ago, to this very date, in fact, a journey that is now reached over a hundred and sixty thousand years and over a hundred thirty countries around the world, a journey that I'm going to recap for you with some of the greatest insights, the greatest lessons that I've learned along the way in episode two hundred and one, so I can help you avoid some of the pitfalls and the road blocks and the dangers that I have encountered along the way to get to episode two hundred, and that is why I want to thank you, the dear listener, for continuing to tune in to join me on this journey. I want to thank you for sharing the insights, in the knowledge that others have passed along to me. Thank you for sharing these with your friends, with your peers, with your colleagues, and thank you for inviting them to join us on this journey as well, because this podcast, as of recording, is one of the top ten percent podcasts in the entire world, according to listen notes and it is also globally ranked as one of the top five banking podcasts to listen to, according to feed spot. But this podcast is not about me. None of this would have been possible without you tuning in too over the past two hundred episodes and sharing this podcast with others. I am just grateful to have the opportunity to continue to educate you, to empower you, to elevate your thinking with the knowledge that others have to share, to inspire you from the journeys, from the progress that others are making as well, because it is through each one of these conversations we all learn, we all grow together, so that together we can make the world one billion in times better by applying the insights and knowledge shared to guide one billion people beyond their financial stress, stress that is taking a toll on their health, their relationships and their overall sense of wellbeing, towards an even bigger, better, brighter future. And that's exactly what each one of these financial brand and Fintech lenders and leaders are doing today on this podcast. They are already banking on expertise, because in today's digital world, money does feel confusing, it can feel frustrating, finances can fill overwhelming for more and more people than ever before. In fact, eighty five percent of Americans are feeling some sort of financial stress, and that is why they are looking for someone that they can trust to guide them, to guide them beyond that stress, to give them help, to give them hope, and each one of the eight guests that you will hear from today are already doing this. They are giving people help, they're giving people hope. They're committed to helping first and selling second, by freely sharing the knowledge and the expertise that they have gained to build trust, to deepen relationships with people in the communities that they serve. I know that you can do the same at your financial brand. I know that you could do the same but your Fintech. It does that matter if you're on the marketing team, it doesn't matter if you're on the cells team, it doesn't matter if you're on the leadership team or the lending team or the branch team with the technology team. You two can do what every single person that you will hear from today, that you will learn from today, just like Paul. Long now, Paul and I had a conversation going back to episode number one hundred and seven, educating and creating a better customer experience within banking. In fact, this is one of my favorite episodes to share with lenders and leaders alike, as Paul is banking on expertise as a senior vice president of business...

...banking and SBA lending at Timberland Bank, and I do highly recommend that you visit Paul's website, www dotcault longcom, as well as connecting with Paul on Linkedin and letting him know that you heard this conversation or episode number one, hundred and seven, because there's a lot to learn from Paul. As Paul notes, banking on expertise is about mindset. It's about creating space and time to commit to helping first and selling second. So, when we're thinking about mental shifts, when we're thinking about mind sets, this idea of taking a proactive stance versus a reactive stance, what are the opportunities here and maybe why? Are A lot of financial brand marketing cells, leadership team members even stuck in a proactive state, stuck into cave of complacency, and how can they break through, break free of that to take more of a proactive stance in relationship building? You know that. That's a great question and I wish I knew that answer because I would be filthy rich if I knew that answer. I'm trying to solve them in because I mean, at the end of the day, yes, I'm busy, but I still have time to market. Market is not something you do just when you're slow. It's something you do all the time. And again the mortgage industry, when they're super busy, boom, they're not marketing. But you know what, that's when they should be. You should always be doing that, and I think that goes back to just being being different in your mindset. Yeah, you have a big pipeline, maybe you've hit your goal for the year, whatever the case is, you still have to go out there and get more business, and I'm just I wish that my industry in general. I'm sorry, wish wasn't so lazy. Be Guys. What can happen is that laziness can kick in because, hey, we get all the big deals coming in, I'm hitting my goal, things are going great, but what about are we in the business to just make a bunch of money or we in the business to help people? And when we're helping people, that's where I get the good feeling inside. I never worry about my goal or the numbers that I need to hit. I always hit those. How am I helping others? How am I giving my knowledge away to help Joe Blow and Idaho get a business loan at whatever bank that's not mine? It doesn't matter. How are we helping? And I think it's that giving back to the community that we serve and just giving back makes me feel good and gets me excited to create a personal brand, because it comes back to that good thinking, great thinking to get started today from Paul, for sure, when it comes to helping first and selling second, when it comes to banking on expertise to build a personal brand, and what it comes to building a personal brand, Natalie Bartholome you is doing the exact same thing herself, as Natalie is the girl banker, and she shared why financial brand leaders should build their personal brands, going back to a conversation that we shared an episode number ninety six. Like Paul, I do highly recommend that you connect with Natalie on Linkedin, as well as visiting her website, www dot thegirl bankercom, where she is working to advocate for and develop the next generation of women in banking. If you've not heard these conversations just yet, dear listener, I highly recommend that you go back and listen to them after the conversation Natalie and I are having today, because once again there's tremendous opportunities for financial brands to educate, to empower their bankers to build their own personal brands as part of a future growth strategy in this postcovid world, because that can help then build networks, to help build communities. But let's start with the end in mind, Natalie, when it comes to this...

...idea of building a personal brand. Why should a banker build a personal brand in the first place? What should that in goal be? So, first and foremost, there's nothing sexy about banking, and I laugh, that's kind of my client in terms of bank marketing. There's literally nothing super exciting about banking and if you can make that exciting, if you can add a personal element to that, I think you're already one step ahead. So being able to build a brand not only around just what you do for your bank, but who you are in your community and what value you add to the industry or to your community in general. I think makes you so much more relatable. We think about how different brands connect with their their buyers these days, to the consumer, it's not necessarily through ads, it's not necessarily through different commercials, but yet they're they're partnering with influencers, they're partnering with people who have a following, that are trusted by that following. Let's use the beauty industry for example. You've got all these influencers who are using these different, different types of makeups and makeup brands and when they test it out and they show the difference it makes for them and how they love it and they're able to give their take on this makeup, people will go and buy it out. It'll be sold out. There's a particular type of mask era that it was trending on ticktock this summer and it was only nine dollars and you can get it at target, you get at Walmart, you can get that at Walgreens and people lost their mind over it because all of these influencers were talking about it on social media. So you think about how bankers have the ability to kind of do that in their own austentic way through social media, by building their own brand, because I truly feel from the community banking space that people bank with people. Now, I understand you might be thinking, you might be feeling right now, banking on expertise, building a personal brand like Paul and Natalie, it sounds like a far off dream, if not impossible for you, along with the other lenders and leaders at your financial brand. But here's the thing, here's the good news. From everything that I have observed over the past twenty years and, more importantly, over the last really two to three years as a digital anthropologist studying the intersection of marketing, cells, technology and human behavior through the Lens of financial services, the micro does in fact have the potential to beat the macro over the next five years or so, and what I mean by that is the micro, meaning lenders and leaders at your financial brand, have the potential to exponentially reach more people through digital, through social channels then your corporate brand does alone. Thanks a lot of sense. People Trust people, people do business with people, especially Lee when they are buying, especially in complex buying journeys like we see in financial services, buying a home, buying a car, growing a business. Put another way, even in today's digital world and verticals where there's a high inherent cognitive load, like financial services. People Bank with people and that's because people trust people, which is exactly why Greg Martin, who is the entrepreneurs banker, believes building a personal brand means investing in yourself, as we discussed an episode number seventy, where he noted he was inspired to move forward on his own journey by Gary Vader Chuck, along with Jim Rouse. Jim joined me for a very early podcast conversation going all the way back to episode number two and, like Natalie, like Paul, I highly recommend connecting with Greg on Linkedin as well, in addition to visiting his website, www dot the entrepreneur...

...bankercom. Let's talk about Gary Because, and I think when you look at your personal brand, and everyone right now go look at Greg's linkedin profile, this is important because you brand yourself as the entrepreneurs banker. How did Gary Vyner Chuck? Love Him, hate him? I mean he is such a polarizing figure and I think there's some lessons to be learned even just with Gary's personal brand. But how did Gary Inspire you to get started down this journey, kind of like this transformative Tony Stark moment when listening to Jim Rouse it. Well, I think that as I was listening to him and I struggle with it for probably well, first off it there's an acquired taste. So took me a good month and a half to to be like, well, this guy's it's just full of it and full of himself, to actually hear what he's saying and to listen and to see the truth in it, and then I was like, okay, well, that's that's great. That that's great for an entrepreneur that owns a lawn care service and they can do whatever the heck they want, they can say whatever they want. Hi, I work in a very regulated industry and I'm not anywhere near the top of my food chain. So there's a whole lot of layers of complexity that that, if I allowed it to, could allow me to be defeated and say don't worry about it, just move on. But the fact that matter is like why not? You know, and the one quote that I knew that this was important and I knew the building a personal brand was going to be a way that, first and foremost, I was able to connect with the entrepreneurs to get the most out of me and I think that's a problem a lot of bankers have. Bankers wanted to be all things to everybody and that's just not the case. So I wanted to connect with the entrepreneurs and get the most out of me that I enjoy that. Do not beat me up over every single rate and fee and every little thing. I mean, I I want to be respective of that, but the end of the day banks provide value and service and they should be compensated for that, but I don't need a client beat me up over SF they cause themselves. Now, while Paul and Greg both work in the business and the commercial side of banking, banking on expertise can also be applied in the mortgage world, which is exactly what Jennifer Beaston is doing and has been doing since January twenty seven, two thousand and seventeen, which was the exact date she started her youtube channel. Jennifer is a top one percent mortgage originator in the nation and she believes content creation is the skill of the decade for lenders and leaders, as she shared an episode number one hundred and five. And, as Jennifer notes, helping first and selling second is about playing a long game and you really must put everything into context through that Lens. You come at this with a lot of empathy because you've been there, you've lived it, you've experienced it, and I think that's what has made your personal story that much more relatable on the other side of the table. And so let's let's flash forward a bit. The day is January twenty seven, two thousand and seventeen, a little more than four years ago, and this was the day that you started your youtube channel that is now received almost four point five million views. And at this time, you are where many of our listeners are today, no matter if their personal brand is something that they're thinking about building. Maybe they're in mortgages, maybe they're in small business, maybe they're a branch manager or they're looking to...

...grow. That what gave you the courage to start down this journey to begin with, recording and uploading video content to Youtube, when you had zero subscribers and zero views? Probably persistence and ignorance. No, look, it's really hard to start. Like I love my old videos because they make me laugh so hard. You know, at first I was doing really heavy. I don't wear makeup, I don't know how to wear makeup, like every time I try to put on makeup I would like a clown and my first videos I literally look like it's nuts and it's so stilted and horrible. It's like, hi, I'm Jennifer Beaston. Today we're going to talk about what a mortgage it. They're horrible, but you know, the process is is that to get to somewhere that you're comfortable, you have to just embrace. Okay, what's the angle here? And I had a couple different angle I was working towards. Like you need to have that in mind because if you're going to go after social media or anything else and you're exciting instant results, you'll get a few pets on the back, you know in the mortgage industry, from realtors and a couple clients, but for the long term games, you gotta just stay there and just accept defeat. And you know, with views, like even now I have a bunch of subscribers, like I have a big business. I still have no idea which videos will do well, but I have to remind myself, Hey, Jennifer, you know you got five hundred views on that video, but five hundred views is just like five hundred people's walking into your store. How would you feel if five hundred people walked into your office in a day? Yes, yeah, and I think that's the key. I think number one it's courage and then I think number two it's that ongoing recommitment and that consistency that ultimately will build confidence over a period of time. And if you think about it, it's been a four year journey. And just I mean just this morning I got an email from Jim Moruse, who has been friend, he's been a guest on this show, and he sits something over from Gary Vander Chuck and he said that the number one gary did, the number one in demand skill for the next ten years is going to be those that understand the power of content creation. And so let me ask you, when things get tough, when that seed of doubt comes into your mind, of you know, why are you doing this? Like how do you how do you silence that voice? Because that's I'm telling you from the conversations that I've had, that voice is what keeps so many people from a starting or be continuing through the dips and the lows. You gotta get over yourself. I mean that's a bottom line. So many people like, because I talked to like signs of mortager Jaires that are like, Oh, well, you know, if I look like you, Jen I would do it, and it's like it has nothing to do with that, nothing, and like there's there's some people who are like, well, I felt a great video, but I didn't like my outfit. No one cares about your outfit. Knowing they're looking for. You need to know what they're looking for. In your industry and my industry, people are so desperate for basic information, because the stuff that and if banking credit, you marketing. People are listening to this, the stuff that they've been delivered is bullshit. I appreciate Jennifer's thinking and she does not mince words here. For sure, banking on expertise is in fact one of the greatest opportunities available for you, a little available for your team, available for your financial brand or Fintech, to transcend the promotion of great rates and amazing service to truly, once and for all, put the transformation of people over the commoditized transaction of dollars.

In Sense. But, as Doug Wilbur CEO of dinhim social noted in our conversation, going back to episode number eighty thought leadership is earned through powerful content. Yeah, people buy from people, and I liked your perspective. People Bank with people, because the concern that I hear, particularly the senior leadership level, is, you know, the fintech threat and you know the Bank of Walmart and the Bank of Amazon. But I am always pushing back in maybe it's just because I'm a bit of a contrarian that. Have you ever tried to get a hold of someone at Amazon? You got a problem, and I've had problems with Amazon, I think, probably more postcovid than ever before. It's a very frustrating experience to where I almost see micro has the potential to beat macro, you know, in this postcovid world, and it's a different way to approach this idea of growth and of cells. How can financial brands and their cells teams create meaningful digital connections? And I think that's the key word. It's meaningful, because there's a lot of financial brands. They historically have spent a tremendous amount of time, effort money to build up social followings, but they lack meaningful connections. So what are some of those opportunities to do just that? Yeah, you know, it's interesting. I was I forget who the article was, but I was just reading the other day about somebody was was pontificating on twitter about it's not how many followers you have, hmm, it's how many people actually want to engage with you in this kind of gets back to this. People buy from people, notion right, is that the biggest opportunity that a financial services organization has is not to try and rack up a we call vanity by tricks. Yep, it doesn't matter at the end of the day how many likes social media post gets. What really matters is your ability to tell a story and to share content that's relevant and actionable for the audiences that you're trying to serve. And so this is a lot of coaching. Happens when we get a new customer and they signed on to the Denim Social Platform, whether that's our organic content posting module or our social advertising and promoted content solution or our lady page conversion, you know platform, all these different platforms working in concert with each other, regardless of where a new customer comes into their journey with our with our brand. At the end of the day, we spend a lot of time at the outset, talking about what are you going to say on social and if you're only thinking about social media as an avenue to promote products, right and to say hey, like sign up for sign up today, to get a you know, an introductory rate on your next checking account, right, then you're no different than anyone else. Right. Where the difference happens is when you say hey, I know that my officers are hyper connected in the communities that we serve as an institution. I want to arm them with interesting and relevant and actionable content so that they can foster a dialog with their communities. And we share our customers all time. It's like, you know, when you're scrolling through your instagram, right, and we say this to the CMO or the CEO the bank or whoever, and maybe they're not on Instagram, but maybe they're on facebook right, or whatever it is, right and they're scrolling through and I say, what content do you stop on when your endlessly thumbing through your feed? You stop on content that comes from people you know and you tend to gloss over the content that comes from brands and it's that's that, and then you see the light bubble go off it's like, all right, now, I get it right. This is why employee advocacy matters for our brand. I agree one hundred percent with Doug that employee advocacy matters to your financial brand, it matters to your Fintech and once again, this is...

...where I see the micro, the personal brands of your lenders, of your leaders, beating the macro, your corporate brand over the next three to five years. In fact, when you think about building a personal brand, it can feel very challenging if you try to do this loan at your own financial brand or Fintech. There's a tremendous opportunity to do this together as a team, to do this together as an organization, because in reality, when you build a personal brand as a team and really as a larger organization, this is how you humanize digital experiences, as j Palter and I discussed an episode number fifty one. You know, when we look at this idea of, for example, Linkedin, I look at Linkedin, that's a community, that's a community of people and in this digital world, postcovid world we're all living in now, community is really transformed. Take the idea of sports. It's a community activity. Community is transformed to where I'm a leader at an organization. I might be a lending I might be in cells, I might be on the executive team. What are the opportunities to take the idea of the local community, because I can still connect with people locally right and build those local relationships in this digital world? Is there an opportunity there? Yeah, I mean I think there's an opportunity online to build relationships with whoever we want to. I think the initial suggest and I'm making is that, and you're echoing back, is listening is really important part of that and you can't have a conversation without listening right and and the way people think of social media is a is a one way pipe where you know they their marketing message needs to get pushed down to the audience. That's when I was always businesswise, excited about. But the reality is, especially in be too B type businesses, you know, social networks are a channel for having a two way communication. That can be locally, it can be with people you know anywhere in the world in fact, because the world basically becomes very small and social network yes, it does. You know, and and I you know, I personally advocate that there are people in any ecosystem that are influential, that have a lot of followers, whose opinions people are listening to, and those people become strategically important people to pay attention to. And they they may be completely outside your market place and maybe in different countries and have nothing to do with it, but somebody in your world may be listening to that person as well, and and your conversation, engagement with them becomes a strategically valuable to you in your business. Community has indeed transformed. Community is no longer confined to physical location like boundaries, ZIP codes, city, states, even countries. When you commit to banking on expertise, when you commit to helping first and selling second, you truly have the potential to create an exponential positive impact in the world by sharing your knowledge, your insight, your ideas, your expertise to educate and empower others to move beyond financial stress, to guide them towards an even bigger, better, brighter future. It is this thinking, is this mindset that puts love and respect back into banking, as Carrie and Betton stimpson and I discussed an episode number sixty two, a carry and is transforming banking for good. As the Como of jmmb group out of Jamaica and carry in is and carry a has also been busy building her own personal brand through the internal marketing podcast, which I highly recommend you listen to as well. And so you're empowering and all of these different areas to elevate the team so that they can elevate the customers of jmmb. Think about this idea of employee marketing, employee advocacy, which which I predict that over the next two to three years will be just as big, if not bigger X. will be bigger than X, particularly in a digital world. What is a common belief in...

...the industry that you passionately disagree with? What do others think about employee advocacy that they might you might disagree with them on? Well, you know, James, I I personally disagree. Let me tell you what it is and I'll tell you why I disagree. So I find that a lot of companies in our industry are reluctant to engage our employees in advocacy because they are concerned about dilusion of the brand or the employees perhaps going rogue and saying things that are inconsistent with the official brand voice, you know, and and that's a valid concern. I'M NOT gonna I'm not gonna not validate it. But the point of the matter is why I disagree with that is, at the end of the day, I always believe marketing is still human to human and statistically it's factual all of the messages that go out via your official brand channels do not reach us far or enjoy the same depth of engagement as those same messages being shared by your employees, by people. People Trust people, people prefer to engage with people, and so for me, I think that brands need to yeah, we need to recognize that having employees as a central, or certainly very important part of our brand message distribution strategy is is very, very important and you're going to get that through advocacy. And there's really no need to be concerned because, first of all, I think there's an opportunity to mitigate against some of those concerns with your typical policies and procedures. But what it also does is it gives your employees the opportunity to be as authentic as possible, which again drives to the heart of what we want to show as a brand that empathy, that concern, that people connection, and so I that's why I would disagree with that baking on expertise comes down to three simple ceas. Number One, communication, number two, connection, number three, community. It's what almost every financial brand has been focused on doing over the past one hundred years or so. From a micro view, it's just the way that we communicate now, it's the way that we connect now, and the way that we build community has transformed. We can't let our fears of communicating through new channels like video, like podcasts, even our fears of compliance hold us back from ascending to a higher purpose where we commit to help first and sell second, by freely sharing our knowledge, our insights, are expertise with those who are in fact looking for hope, they're looking for help. But it is not just about sharing our knowledge and our ideas and our expertise. That's only one side of the equation. We must also be open. We must be willing to share our personal selves as well, because, once again, people connect with people, people bank with people. In fact, the basics and the foundations of how we communicate, how we connect, how we build relationships and how we build community. The basics remain the same, as Eric Cook and I discussed an episode number eighty one, where he shared social media secrets to build relationships and a digital world. It's a great point, though. I like that. I like that that idea of of I think it's connection and belonging and that's what we're all we're really all seeking that at the end of the day. Now, at the end of the day, he was a cat person, it might have been a completely different story. I like cats, I'm just allergic to him. So it's not like any of your listeners that there cat people that I am anti anti kitty cat feelings, because that's not the case. I love up a kitty and then I'll pay for it later on with Itchy eyes and sneezing. So I'm just a big animal love at heart. But I think the original question, if I go back and remember what it was before I went on my dog tangent,...

...was a lot of bankers that we talked to our resistance to participate in social media because I think the the thoughts or the fear is or maybe the reality is one they're not maybe allowed to participate while they're at the office due to technological constraints and security concerns. They may be suggested not to participate because of compliance and trigger terms and other sorts of regulatory pressure that we have to be cognizant of. But at the end of the day, being comfortable talking about yourself and the things that really don't have anything to do with banking that would cause compliance or security or privacy. But put the customer at the end of the discussion and what is it that they are interested in knowing, learning wanting to know? I mean, I've read your book, We are part of Your Book Club and you have a very apparent focus on putting the customer at the heart of everything that you do and not focusing on look, what we're doing as a bank. It's what do they want to know, what are they looking for, and producing content that answers those questions, and a lot of times that might not be content that has anything to do you are a busy professional with for young children and probably our time starved and wondering how you're going to get it done in the day, and I find a commercial lender interesting and attracting you as a potential client to my bank. It's going to behoove me to share content around time management, efficiency, tricks, ways to get more done, things that will resonate with you and you'll think, wow, that's really helpful, that's really great, that's really interesting, not really knowing that you're building a relationship with me, but when the time comes that you have a banking or a financial need, I'll have put enough coin in that Karma bucket that I likely will get invited to that conversation and I can serve you at that point with a financial need when you're ready for it, not when I want to sell it to you. Banking on expertise is a practice, it is a habit founded in banking on the future. It is about bringing the future into the present moment. It is about transforming banking for good. Because would you commit to help first and sell second? When you commit to play the long game of running the good race, when you commit to sharing your knowledge, your ideas, your insights, your expertise, along with your personal self as well, you are making positive deposits into the most important trust fund in today's digital world that sits between people's ears, their brain and over time, deposit after deposit, the investments you continue to make by educating, by empowering. By elevating others, you will guide people in the communities you serve, physical communities, digital communities, beyond their financial stress that is taking a toll on their health, their relationships and their overall sense of wellbeing. Right now, in the present moment, you will in fact lead them. You will guide them towards an even bigger, better and brighter future. And that is the secret to all of this, because when you commit to creating an even bigger, better and brighter future for others, you will create an even bigger, better and brighter future for yourself, and I look forward to creating that future together with you. As always, and until next time, be well, do good and make your bed. Thank you for listening to another episode of banking on Digital Growth with James Robert Leigh. To get even more practical and proven insights, along with coaching and guidance, Visit Digital growthcom insider to join a community of growth minded marketing and sales leaders from financial brands and thin text. Until next time, be well and do good.

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Episodes (234)